tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post4312730643803104556..comments2022-07-04T09:03:16.720-07:00Comments on Bill Fulton, former Mayor of Ventura: Measure J Was Illegal -- And Too Extreme For VenturaBill Fultonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10833863247431014699noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-83686701709457946212011-09-20T15:10:06.757-07:002011-09-20T15:10:06.757-07:00It appears to me that Bill and his buddies are eit...It appears to me that Bill and his buddies are either ignorant or think that "WE THE PEOPLE" are. The mayor and others must be aware that they are a dues paying part of ICLEI (United Nations affiliate) through SCAGG Planning and finally impacted through Ventura Compact. All of this in the name of Sustainability, Smart Growth, Going Green--- which is nothing more than a concentrated effort to control our housing, water, energy, transportation and land - by the elite few! We will be following the money (Federal Grants)-to see who is really benefitting. WE will be electing those who actually care about FREEDOM and have conservative fiscal values.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-73140021773306847532011-09-14T00:32:00.211-07:002011-09-14T00:32:00.211-07:00“Turner, who ran as a staunch conservative embraci...“Turner, who ran as a staunch conservative embracing the Tea Party, will be the first House Republican representing this portion of Queens since the 1920s — a striking departure from its Democratic traditions.”<br /><br />For the complete story visit: www.washingtonpost.com/politics/republican-wins-democratic-new-york-house-seat/2011/09/13/gIQAoos5QK_print.html<br /><br />And some think the Tea Party is ineffective!Mike B.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-54276916160607528232011-09-09T13:01:11.936-07:002011-09-09T13:01:11.936-07:00I agree with Lois P. People love to dismiss the T...I agree with Lois P. People love to dismiss the Tea Party as wild-eyed lunatics when, in fact, they have proven to be extremely effective, savvy participants in the political process. Look how prominently their influence was felt during the debate on the national debt ceiling. Had it not been for the Tea Party's involvement, we would have ended up with Obama's original plan (higher taxes during a really bad economy - a recipe for disaster).<br /><br />I think it will be very interesting to see how the two Tea Party-backed candidates (Carla Bonney and Bill Knox) do in the City Council race in November. I'm sure they will be getting the support of a good number of the 10,000 folks who signed to parking meter initiative. Good luck to them both!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-8484602180348928912011-09-07T08:45:58.417-07:002011-09-07T08:45:58.417-07:00To say that the Tea Party has been ineffective sho...To say that the Tea Party has been ineffective shows just how detached some are from reality. All you need to do is go back to the appointment of Scott Brown and our last national election when several Tea Party supported candidates were elected to Congress. They will also have a big say in 2012. Wait and see!<br /><br />Unlike many who posted here, Americans from all political parties have awakened and are thankfully participating in the democratic process.Lois P.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-42352004390641414372011-09-06T23:32:06.415-07:002011-09-06T23:32:06.415-07:00Bryan L.'s comment is a fair one, but this who...Bryan L.'s comment is a fair one, but this whole issue was aired out at some length at the July 11 council meeting. Yes, Ms. Bonney discussed her proposed measure with the City Attorney before she gathered signatured. However, as the City Attorney explained, whether we like it or not, it is not the City Attorney's job to provide legal advice to individual citizens who have drafted an initiative they are thinking of circulating. At that point it is his job to review the initiative for its form, not its substance, and write a "ballot title" to be used on the petitions.<br /><br />Indeed, from the point of view of legal ethics, it would be a conflict of interest for him to provide advice to the initiative's drafters, especially if the proposed initiative conflicts with the city's existing policies adopted by the City Council, whom the City Attorney also advises. Any private lawyer would recuse himself from such a situation and advise his prospective client to find a different lawyer.<br /><br />It is always a good idea for initiative drafters to obtain their own expert legal advice. By expert I mean not just any lawyer, but somebody who is well schooled in municipal law and relevant state laws (such as, in this case, the Vehicle Code).<br /><br />Many ballot measures with some legal deficiencies are placed on ballots throughout California, even if the City Attorney is concerned about their legality, and are sued and often struck down after the election. For example, Mr. Calonne had considerable concerns about the legality of Measure B, the view initiative that failed in 2009; and I believe parts of it would have failed in court if it had passed. But part of that measure was clearly legal and therefore a pre-election challenge was not warranted and would not have succeeded.<br /><br />I would note that although Mr. Calonne had concerns about the legality of Measure J from the time it was written, I believe at that time he did not think (as he did not think with Measure B in 2009) that those deficiencies warranted a pre-election challenge. It was only when the City Council specifically asked him to research the legality of the initiative that he did much more extensive legal research and found the court cases that were directly on point and caused the initiative to be removed from the ballot.<br /><br />You can watch the video of the July 11 council meeting here:<br /><br />http://cityofventura.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php?view_id=2&clip_id=746Bill Fultonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10833863247431014699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-13581243104472980362011-09-06T23:29:32.846-07:002011-09-06T23:29:32.846-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Bill Fultonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10833863247431014699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-79360782843910422352011-09-06T15:19:56.975-07:002011-09-06T15:19:56.975-07:00“Unfortunately, Measure J's proponents didn...“Unfortunately, Measure J's proponents didn't do their legal homework.”<br /><br />What the Mayor neglected to mention in his blog and the VC Star article was that Ms. Bonney did, in fact, seek legal guidance from our City Attorney before gathering signatures. After the requirements were met, he recommended the City Council test its validity by taking voters to court. <br /><br />I would invite Mr. Fulton to elaborate on this part of the story.Bryan L.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-29054524339128787152011-09-06T14:27:48.772-07:002011-09-06T14:27:48.772-07:00@Tea Partiers:
Not only is this initiative getting...@Tea Partiers:<br />Not only is this initiative getting rid of a SOCIALIST (or communist, for you nutballs) perk that COSTS THE TAXPAYER, but creates a government controlled market for parking (if it weren't government controlled, prices would likely be higher).<br /><br />The lack of understanding on the part of many people here (ie. Marion B) makes me wonder if they completed school and how their ignorance of the law can be so widely held. Besides this, the "American way of life" isn't threatened by a parking meter, but rather by people who believe that the military shouldn't be cut down by a huge amount, who are against the government providing any services (the government provides services that don't make money, like roads, police, transit, firefighters, parks, etc.), and who believe that these things can be provided for a taxation amount of 0%.<br /><br />I see a bleak future for the US so long as nutjobs like the Tea Party have any sort of voice.Jim Calakasnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-47718848022267936892011-09-06T13:20:33.124-07:002011-09-06T13:20:33.124-07:00I can't believe how many people seem to be ign...I can't believe how many people seem to be ignoring the issue that Measure J is illegal under California law! It doesn't matter that 10,000 citizens signed the petition. The measure was illegal and the courts would not have allowed it. Now--if the people want to get together and change the California Constitution so that it would be legal--that's another matter. Or if they want to carry the Measure on to the state Supreme Court and see if they would decide the Measure was legal--then they'd have a way to force the city to comply. But as it stands right now--even if the city complied with the requests of the petition signers--the Measure is ILLEGAL and the city could get into legal difficulties for implementing the citizens requests.Cameron Mnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-58110860522045432842011-09-06T12:59:27.503-07:002011-09-06T12:59:27.503-07:00bill...there's a great (now defunct) comic str...bill...there's a great (now defunct) comic strip called "get your war on" by david rees. perhaps you've seen it. <br /><br />anyway, one great panel that i have hanging in my office is a character saying "if 'elitist' just means 'not the dumbers motherf****r in the room,' i'll be an elitist!" <br /><br />this is what you're contending with when your attempt to reasonably explain why you're glad that something that doesn't conform with the state's constitution and is bad policy in any event isn't on the ballot is called every pejorative term under the sun.<br /><br />for a more historically rooted version of what you're dealing with can be gained by reading lincoln's cooper union speech. good luckAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-4876090086403164522011-09-05T14:12:12.460-07:002011-09-05T14:12:12.460-07:00The Mayor has made the mistake of gloating too soo...The Mayor has made the mistake of gloating too soon! The parking meters have become one of the main issues in our upcoming election and a motivation for a larger number of voters to go to the polls. It’s very possible that the elimination of Measure J will lead to a new majority at City Hall who honor the wishes of the voters by removing them. <br /><br />Maybe taking the people who pay the bills to court wasn’t such a good idea after all!Bill W.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-76813296210626517022011-09-05T10:54:56.320-07:002011-09-05T10:54:56.320-07:00As a grandmother who signed the petition, your wor...As a grandmother who signed the petition, your words, Mr. Fulton, are a slap in the face to me, my husband, and the more than 10,000 voters and residents of Ventura. We sent a clear message to City Hall and your response was--go to hell! <br /><br />You can continue to portray yourself as the victim and bad mouth the Tea Party but it’s not going to hide the obvious contempt you have for the taxpayer and the traditional American way of life to the informed citizen who understands liberal tactics. <br /><br />We need more representatives like Neal Andrews and Jim Monahan who actually serve their constituents so Carla Bonney will get our vote in November.Marion B.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-28542858965465342382011-09-02T08:10:17.292-07:002011-09-02T08:10:17.292-07:00Mayor Fulton - this was a very well presented and ...Mayor Fulton - this was a very well presented and reasoned blog post. We need good public servants in this country like you to fight for rational policies. <br /><br />Its a pretty sad day when municipal parking regulations get caught in such heated political debate. If you study urban planning (which evidently Ms. Bonney has not) you will see that these rules are pretty much standard best practice for cities and town across the United States; parking meters have been in place in the U.S. since the 30s, decades before the UN's Agenda 21 came out, and are treated as pretty mundane civic matters in the rest of the country. <br /><br />To those who talk about how the city's parking policy is un-American, part of a global plot, violating the constitution, and use quotes by Jefferson - please tone down the rhetoric and check back into reality. To use this language to describe something so ordinary as municipal parking policy sounds ludicrous at best or intentionally deceitful at worst.Mattnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-25504868312623501012011-09-01T17:22:11.758-07:002011-09-01T17:22:11.758-07:00Here is why the Tea Party people are not effective...Here is why the Tea Party people are not effective. Instead of addressing the issues they focus their arguments on emotionally charged hyperbole and distractions. If they continue to do so, they will continue to look ill informed and reactionary. I am not sure how that helps what ills America.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-38148882407151803622011-09-01T13:46:24.325-07:002011-09-01T13:46:24.325-07:00Someone beat me to it! I wanted to point out the ...Someone beat me to it! I wanted to point out the irony that the anti-government Tea Party, which rails against "socialism," is apparently in favor of socialized parking. In other words, they think that the city government should make public resources available on a first-come, first-served basis without any concern for market forces. Would they take this position on anything else? Health care? Housing?<br /><br />It never ceases to amaze me how many "conservatives" can be so inconsistent in their beliefs. Our auto-centric transportation system is heavily government subsidized (just as our land use patterns are). Liberals like me might actually be able to find some common ground with right-wingers on certain issues because we think that the government should STOP subsidizing certain destructive transportation and land use policies. (Admittedly, I'm OK with the government subsidizing DIFFERENT policies, so maybe that's where the agreement would break down, but we could meet halfway at least...). But apparently the proposal that users should pay for the parking they consume, rather than expecting it to be provided free at government expense (aka "socialism") meets with the vitriol of the right wing!<br /><br />I thought the Mayor's post was not the least bit condescending or offensive. He pointed out the facts as they relate to the judge's decision, and he defended the policy on the basis of its merits (without resorting to pointing out the inconsistency of the Tea Party position...I couldn't resist that, though!). A respectful post and good politics, re-election campaign or not...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-16220903682268320982011-09-01T13:20:39.360-07:002011-09-01T13:20:39.360-07:00First, I am broken hearted to hear that Bill is no...First, I am broken hearted to hear that Bill is not running for re-election. I only wish that the village I live in had a village president as rational, reasonable, common sensical (is that even a word?), and knowledgeable about city planning as Bill Fulton.<br /><br />This referendum illustrates that the Tea Party lives in an alternative universe far removed from reality and uses the Big Lie at the local level as well as national. I don't think folks in Ventura know how fortunate they are. Where I live, there's a two hour parking limit (and it's enforced) in front our home and throughout our neighborhood, plus overnight street parking is prohibited. Now that's intrusive with no rational justification. I suspect the Tea Party people would say it's part of that international sustainability conspiracy -- even though these restrictions were in place decades before the word "sustainability" was even created.Dan_Lhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01972188057525503921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-42617924095557026662011-09-01T10:55:42.610-07:002011-09-01T10:55:42.610-07:00I'm glad to hear that this measure wad thrown ...I'm glad to hear that this measure wad thrown out. After the community meetings where they claimed this was some kind of conspiracy pushing agenda 21, I was like these people are crazy! I'm glad this went down in flames. Downtown is a lot nicer and parking is easier to find.Paul Blitzstiennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-87906279448849500182011-08-31T13:32:50.502-07:002011-08-31T13:32:50.502-07:00It's funny that those who claim to run under t...It's funny that those who claim to run under the free market tea party banner would oppose the city essentially creating a market for parking. The old system of free parking is no different than communists handing out free bread. In the old system without market prices, supply and demand move out of equilibrium leading to scarcity. Just as bread became scarce in the soviet union without adequate pricing so to did parking in free priced Downtown Ventura. The city has corrected this mistake by beginning to institute market prices for downtown parking. If the tea partners are upset that the city has setup this marketplace there is another alternative..... Allow private companies to take over the pricing and management of the downtown parking. I can guarantee you that under a truely privatized system you'd be paying more than $1 per hour... And i can guarantee you that there would be no free coupons during Christmas, which would obviously be the most profitable time of the year for such a private company. Either way it baffles me that people who fly under the supposedly libertarian tea party banner would oppose market prices to defend socialist free parking... But then again I've seen crazier things from the faux libertarian tea party before... Next time you walk in to a grocery store remember that no product in the store is free. Can you imagine if chocolate cake was free?? There would be an instant run on the cake leading to a shortage. So if cake isn't free and needs market prices to adequately manage supply why wouldn't parking require the same? In the end all resources are scarce and require pricing. I commend Mayor Fulton for sticking to his guns because Ventura is already beginning to reap the benefits a safer, more productive and efficient downtown. For the so called "Tea Partiers" they should really educate themselves and read "The High Cost of Free Parking" by Donald Shoup instead of hurling insults at the Mayor. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-3352105450000373182011-08-31T10:50:29.883-07:002011-08-31T10:50:29.883-07:00Mayor Fulton, while I admit that I am not a reside...Mayor Fulton, while I admit that I am not a resident of your town, I admire your apparent patience and willingness to work with what I assume is a vocal minority of purely self-interested residents who have failed to educate themselves about the issues. It is unfortunate that Tea Party members must continue to follow a stereotype of obnoxious and ideological tyrants who wield ad hominem attacks rather than logic, because at least some of their principles are worthy of discussion. Thank you for your hard work, and best of luck to you.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05457888915340281683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-69026073082430978052011-08-31T09:12:52.284-07:002011-08-31T09:12:52.284-07:00Wait a minute... somebody from the Tea Party doesn...Wait a minute... somebody from the Tea Party doesn't understand how the law works, and doesn't know the difference between a referendum and an initiative? Gee, what a surprise!<br /><br />Having moved here from Dallas five years ago I'm amazed at how much time, effort and vitriol has been expended over these ONE DOLLAR per hour parking meters. If the city had completely eliminated free parking in the lots and garage as well I would understand it a little more. But they didn't... there's still plenty of free parking if you don't mind walking about, oh let's see, ONE BLOCK.<br /><br />Ventura, you've got it pretty good if this is the worst thing you can think of to fight over. <br />Mayor Fulton, I admire your patience and willingness to explain your position and find common ground with the few noisy morons who keep hounding you about this. I would have told the whole lot to go jump off the pier long ago.Brianhttp://www.venturamojo.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-34864507428176661422011-08-30T18:32:02.807-07:002011-08-30T18:32:02.807-07:00I don't think you should post any comments tha...I don't think you should post any comments that post as anonymous.<br />If you stand behind what you say....then quit choosing to post as anonymous.<br />Quit hiding behind a keyboard!Colettahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06185991763106815108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-84119907196748957672011-08-30T16:33:43.265-07:002011-08-30T16:33:43.265-07:00I don't see him being snotty at all.
I was...I don't see him being snotty at all. <br /><br />I was concerned about how the parking meters would affect the merchants, and I think the city should keep monitoring the situation and adjust accordingly, and should again give out free coupons during the month of December. <br /><br />I think the meters are an annoyance to use, but I do like parking close to the place I'm going so I don't get hit up for money as I used to when I would have to walk a couple of blocks, a couple of the guys were very in your face and scary with their tactics.Saranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-1487805734375403302011-08-30T11:14:55.887-07:002011-08-30T11:14:55.887-07:00I, too, am glad you're not running again... yo...I, too, am glad you're not running again... your blog has already been called what it really is by others so I will not go further except to add that, like so many others, you use your position to attack the Tea Party. Though I'm not officially a member, I strongly oppose the attacks on them for political reasons, rather than observing their stance as free American citizens. I repeat, I am glad that this platform for your unwelcome attacks will soon come to an end.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-75040134522500635372011-08-29T21:38:57.950-07:002011-08-29T21:38:57.950-07:00Thanks again to all who have written. So far in th...Thanks again to all who have written. So far in these comments, I have been called snotty, condescending, deceitful, mean-spirited, and offensive. However, so far nobody has taken issue with any fact I have presented or any interpretation I have made. There is an old adage then when the facts are not on your side, attack the other person instead, and that seems to be happening in this case.Bill Fultonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5724930802169463212.post-88138927248923151172011-08-29T21:05:16.421-07:002011-08-29T21:05:16.421-07:00Bill Fulton is not running for reelection, so I gu...Bill Fulton is not running for reelection, so I guess he can be as snotty as he likes with no repercussions. Good to see that his true colors have been revealed here. It will remind all of us that we need to vote to unseat his like-minded colleagues who are seeking reelection this fall - Christy Weir and Carl Morehouse.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com